From: morita <morita@isct.kyutech.ac.jp>
Real-Date: Fri, 6 Aug 93 21:05:21 +0900
Subject: [infotalk,00276] Re: new gopher?
Message-Id: <9308061205.AA23919@hiko.isct.kyutech.ac.jp>
守田＠九州工業大学です。
||Subject: [infotalk,00275] Re: new gopher?
||鎌原さん、神戸さん、それから、池田さんもありがとうございました。
いいだしっぺの私からもありがとうございました。
まとめて下さった たかださん、ありがとうございました。
||企業が自社の商品等の情報の提供手段として gopher を使う場合はお金を払う必
いろいろややこしいんですね。
WAISとか他のインフォメーションツールの方も、なんかそんな問題が
ありそうですがどんなになってるのだろう？
===================== 九州工業大学大学院 工学研究科 電気工学専攻M1
システム研究室 守田 智己
===================== E-mail morita@isct.kyutech.ac.jp
From: TAKADA Toshihiro (高田敏弘) <takada@seraph.NTT.JP>
Real-Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1993 17:51:43 +0900
Subject: [infotalk,00275] Re: new gopher?
Message-Id: <9308060851.AA09498@seraph.ntt.jp>
たかだです。
鎌原さん、神戸さん、それから、池田さんもありがとうございました。
In <infotalk:00274>
"Junzou Kamahara <kamahara@ics.es.osaka-u.ac.jp>"-san writes:
> いや、これはGNU publishing Licenceに従ったフリーのGopherサーバーです。
> ...
> たしか、Gopherは研究機関がinternetにサービスを提供するのは、自由だけ
> ど、企業としてサービスする場合にはGopher Inc.にお金を払わなきゃいけな
> いんではなかったでしょうか？これはちょっとはっきりしないんですが。
この話は一時期 comp.infosystems.* で大騒動になりました。結局、
企業が自社の商品等の情報の提供手段として gopher を使う場合はお金を払う必
要がある。企業が gopher server を開いても、そこに置いてある情報が直接商
売に関係ない場合についてはグレイゾーン。ただし gopher protocol はフリー
に公開するので、それを見て自分でサーバーなりクライアントなりを作るのは自
由(それを商売に使うのも自由？)。
というのが最終的な UMN gopher team の主張だったようです。その記事を最後
に付けますので、読みたい方はどうぞ。
で、この gn というのは、そういった流れの中で作られた、フリーな gopher
server なんですね、きっと。どうもありがとうございました。
========================================================================
ＮＴＴ基礎研究所 情報科学研究部 高田敏弘
分散コンピューティング原理研究グループ takada@nttlab.ntt.JP
========================================================================
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: gopher@boombox.micro.umn.edu ("The Minnesota Gopher Team" )
Newsgroups: comp.infosystems.gopher
Subject: University of Minnesota Gopher software licensing policy.
Message-ID: <9303112108.AA10984@boombox.micro.umn.edu>
Date: 11 Mar 93 21:08:26 GMT
Sender: news@news2.cis.umn.edu
Distribution: comp
Lines: 89
Approved: comp.infosystems.gopher@news.cis.umn.edu
Original-To: pacs-l@uhupvm1.uh.edu, review@msen.com, com-priv@uu.psi.com,
gopher-news@boombox.micro.umn.edu
In the best of USENET tradition there has been a lot of hysteria,
misinformation, and rumor floating around that this note is being
written to address. Please treat this as an "official" University
of Minnesota Gopher Team position. We'll put this document up so
that anyone can get a copy before they howl.
In a time where we are having budgets slashed, it is impossible
to justify continued (increasing) resources being allocated to
Gopher development unless some good things result for
the University of Minnesota. This is a fact of life.
We can make a case that if you put up a gopher server that
makes useful information available to the Internet, then there
is more useful information available to the University of
Minnesota academic community also. Hence this is a Good Thing.
If on the other hand you put up a gopher server that is
commercial in nature and either inaccessible to the world or
containing information whose primary purpose is to MAKE YOU
MONEY, then we have a hard time making a case for our
admistrators supporting this. Indeed if you look at this
honestly, a licence fee is the right and proper thing to do.
Remember when UNIX was given away free?
How many of you are using UNIX now? It is licensed.
First, in the case of gopher servers run by higher education
or non-profit organizations offering information freely
accessible to the Internet, there is no change. No fees.
They just continue to use Gopher like they have always
done. If you fall under this category, please stop
and think about it. Nothing's changed.
In the case where gopher servers are being used internally
by commercial entities we think a license fee is right.
We don't know what amount of a fee is reasonable: so YOU
have to tell us and we need to negotiate on a case by case
basis. What is loose change for a large corporation may
be prohibitive for a small business. We'd like some
kind of sliding scale.
In the case of gopher servers offering information that is
sold, again we think a fee is reasonable and further that
it be some small fraction of your sales. Once more, we
need to negotiate a reasonable fraction on a case by case
basis. So comparing YOUR agreement with the one we make
with the guy next door might not be a fruitful thing to do.
Finally, there is the grey area where information on a
server run by a commercial entity is accessible to all.
Now having price-lists of your products (for example)
available, really is a direct benefit to you. On the
other hand, while having usefully compiled lists or indexed
journals may well be an indirect benefit to you (folks
will think well of your company and services) they have
a direct benefit to everyone. In these cases, we'd like
YOU to make a case arguing that the material on your
server falls into the second category, enabling us to
give you a license without a fee.
Yes, it may seem unfair that we get to decide whether
your commercial server should be given a license to use
our software without a charge.... but there it is.
We are not out to make big money here. We are simply
facing the realities of our environment and having to
justify how we spend OUR resources also.
The Internet Gopher protocol is documented and we're
also just about done with an informational RFC.
Folks can and have written clients and servers for
Gopher. You can also do it.
Before you go off and flame once more, ask yourself if
you want to get YOUR particular server going with as
little fuss and expense as possible... or if you just
want to stir up the soup. Then do what you wish.
We want to keep things working for all of you, and get
ourselves the okays from above to keep doing that.
If you want to be productive, talk to Shih Pau Yen;
he's the one with the power to do the deals. He
can be reached at
yen@boombox.micro.umn.edu
or (612) 624-8865
Please don't abuse the Gopher Development team :-)
- Yen and the Minnesota Gopher Team
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Junzou Kamahara <kamahara@ics.es.osaka-u.ac.jp>
Real-Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1993 13:47:52 +0900
Subject: [infotalk,00274] Re: new gopher?
Message-Id: <9308060448.AA03224@neptune.ics.es.osaka-u.ac.jp>
鎌原です。
> > gn（ニュースリーダーかと思ったら違うらしい）とかいうのが
>
> これ(gn)は知らないです。何なのでしょう? > どなたか。
いや、これはGNU publishing Licenceに従ったフリーのGopherサーバーです。
うちではこれで動かしています。もとのGopherサーバーは見ていないので、
違いはちょっと分かりません。
たしか、Gopherは研究機関がinternetにサービスを提供するのは、自由だけ
ど、企業としてサービスする場合にはGopher Inc.にお金を払わなきゃいけな
いんではなかったでしょうか？これはちょっとはっきりしないんですが。
---------
ANNOUNCING GN RELEASE 0.5
A FREE SERVER FOR THE INTERNET GOPHER PROTOCOL.
FEATURES: ( * means new in version 0.5)
o Per Directory Access control.
o Support for structured files
o Much faster file searches
o Builtin menu hierarchy searches.
o Documentation [Man pages and installation guide, improved and extensive]
o Free for any use, commericial or otherwise! (GNU license)
o Easier maintenance [well, at least IMHO :) ]
o Capability to decouple menus from filesystem (*)
AVAILABLE VIA GOPHER:
Server: hopf.math.nwu.edu port 70
Get file: gn-0.5.tar.Z
You can also browse the source and documentation here.
Gn is a gopher protocol server which is written in C and runs under
UNIX. It is freely available for any use, commercial or otherwise.
The software is freely redistributable under the terms of the GNU
public license. There is good documentation -- three man pages and an
installation and maintenance guide. Also be sure to read the
philosophy and design statement.
Gn supports the standard text and binary types, including sound and
image. Since the CSO type requires nothing from the server it is
supported too. Also gn will exec programs (with arguments) much like
gopherd does. Index types are limited. There is not yet support for
WAIS indices, only for programs (or shell scripts) which return
"virtual directories" and also for the "grep" type searches. There is
not yet ftp daemon support, (though the perl go2ftp gateway should
work). Gn runs only under inetd. See the man page for details.
Gn has "per directory" access control. You can have different access
(by IP address or subnet) to every directory if you want to. You don't
need to run different servers on different ports to have different
levels of access! On the other hand, the access is no finer than a
directory. There are no distinctions like separate browsing,
searching and viewing permissions as in gopherd. (I just never found
these worth the trouble.)
New features in version 0.5 include the possibility of decoupling the
menu hierarchy from the filesystem. Normally the gn menu hierarchy is
closely linked to the hierarchy of the file system containing the
files being served, and this is as it should be. However, in certain
circumstances it may be desirable to decouple these two hierarchies.
One might, for some reason, want all the files to be in a single
directory but still have an extensive hierarchy of menus. One reason
for doing this would be to facilitate using gn as a front end for some
other programs which produce data.
The auxillary program "mkcache" has not changed from version 0.4.
John Franks Dept of Math. Northwestern University
john@math.nwu.edu
From: Takahiro Kanbe <taka@nwt.fxis.fujixerox.co.jp>
Real-Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1993 13:42:01 +0900
Subject: [infotalk,00273] Re: new gopher?
Message-Id: <199308060442.NAA15859@litra.nwt.fxis.fujixerox.co.jp>
いろいろな、謎の単語(?)にあまり付いていけてないFXISの神戸です。
>> gn（ニュースリーダーかと思ったら違うらしい）とかいうのが
>
>これ(gn)は知らないです。何なのでしょう? > どなたか。
--
神戸 隆博（かんべ たかひろ） FXIS / taka@fxis.fujixerox.co.jp
From: john@math.nwu.edu (John Franks)
Newsgroups: comp.infosystems.gopher
Subject: GN release 0.6 (no longer "beta")
Date: 30 Jul 1993 01:59:08 GMT
Organization: Dept of Math, Northwestern Univ
Lines: 123
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <239v9c$5s0@news.acns.nwu.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hopf.math.nwu.edu
GN Release 0.6
A Free Server for the Internet Gopher Protocol
FEATURES: ( * means new in version 0.6)
o Interactive forms / Data base front end support (*)
o Per Directory Access control.
o Support for structured files
o Support for compressed files (*)
o Builtin menu hierarchy searches.
o Free for any use, commercial or otherwise! (GNU license)
o Capability to decouple menus from filesystem
AVAILABLE VIA GOPHER:
Server: hopf.math.nwu.edu port 70
Get file: gn-0.6.tar.Z
You can also browse the source and documentation here.
OR BY ANONYMOUS FTP:
FTP to: hopf.math.nwu.edu
Get file pub/gn/gn-0.6.tar.Z
Gn is a gopher protocol server which is written in C and runs under
UNIX. It is freely available for any use, commercial or otherwise.
The software is freely redistributable under the terms of the GNU
public license. There is good documentation -- three man pages and an
installation and maintenance guide. Also be sure to read the
philosophy and design statement.
Gn has "per directory" access control. You can have different access
(by IP address or subnet) to every directory if you want to. You don't
need to run different servers on different ports to have different
levels of access!
Gn supports the standard text and binary types, including sound and
image. Since the CSO type requires nothing from the server it is
supported too. Index types are limited. There is not yet support for
WAIS indices, only for programs (or shell scripts) which return
"virtual directories" and also for the "grep" type searches. There is
not yet ftp daemon support.
Gn runs only under inetd. See the man page for details.
New features in version 0.6 include the support for compressed files
allowing automatic decompression as they are served.
The main new gn feature in this version is designed to be a front end
to data bases and also to handle interactive forms. It works like
this. In your menu file (aka .links or .names) instead of the usual
Name= Path= Type= stuff, you put something like
Form=Fill out this form
Path=1form/dir/script
Name=Select an item to enter information
Path=0/dir/instructions(0/dir/script.cache)
Field=Your name:
Field=Your email address:
Choose=Your favorite color:
Choices=Red Orange Yellow Green Blue Indigo Violet
Done=Done: submit this form
Endform=
The client user is presented with a menu item "Fill out this form".
When it is selected the client gets a menu like
1. Instructions (Select an item to enter information)
2. Your name:
3. Your email address:
4. Your favorite color:
5. Done: submit this form
If the user picks 1. he gets instructions as a text document. If he
picks 2. he is prompted for a string and enters his name. The
next menu looks the same as above but fills in the entered item,
i.e. the new line 2 looks like
2. Your name: [John Doe]
If 4. is picked the user is presented with a menu of items (all the
choices listed above in the menu file).
The user can change any entered values, but when he is satisfied
he selects 5. and the shell script (or perl script or C program)
in the file /dir/script is executed with arguments the name,
email address, and color entered by the user.
You can try this yourself by gophering to hopf.math.nwu.edu 70
and selecting the the item "Experimental interactive form". It
will send you an email message. There is also a calendar server
example you can try.
THANKS
I would like to thank the many people who have aided in the creation
of the gn package, either through writing code or finding and fixing
bugs. They include Earle Ake, Henry Cejtin, Paul DuBois, Jishnu
Mukerji, Marko Nordberg, Stephen Trier, Ed Vielmetti, and Rico Tudor.
John Franks Dept of Math. Northwestern University
john@math.nwu.edu
John Franks Dept of Math. Northwestern University
john@math.nwu.edu
From: Hiroaki IKEDA <ikeda@hike.te.chiba-u.ac.jp>
Real-Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1993 00:04:10 +0900
Subject: [infotalk,00272] Re: new gopher?
Message-Id: <25626.744563050@hike1.hike.te.chiba-u.ac.jp>
千葉大学の池田です。
>Date: Thu, 5 Aug 93 22:36:39 +0900
>Message-Id: <9308051336.AA06673@seraph.ntt.jp>
>From: TAKADA Toshihiro (高田敏弘) <takada@seraph.ntt.jp>
>
> > gn（ニュースリーダーかと思ったら違うらしい）とかいうのが
>
> これ(gn)は知らないです。何なのでしょう? > どなたか。
Tcl/Tkに基づいたWindow Programming環境でしょう。
wish(window shell)のsucriptであるTcl/Tkもかなり良好なProgramming
環境を提供し、ドキュメントもしっかりしており、広報活動も
大々的にやっていますね。これをさらにマクロにして使い易く
(あるいはプログラミングしやすく)しようとするわけです。
これに類するものとしては、wafeなどもありますね。
去年はXLibに基づいてプログラムを学生に作ってもらいましたが、
まとまったプログラムにはかなり手間がかかりました。
そこで、gsやwafeを使うことを強力に推奨しているところなのですが
なかなか乗ってきてくれません。
卒業間際になれば、例年の通りなんとかなるでしょう。
＃少し脱線しました。